Animal Crossing will forever be a kids game that changed my life profoundly, and twice. Like most of us, Animal Crossing got me through Covid19. It was such a strange time to be locked in and spending 10 hours of every day working on collecting and manicuring your town. I remember my sister and I really bonded over this game, and there were many days where my mom and dad watched us play.
But aside from a worldwide pandemic, I remember the first time Animal Crossing changed my perspective was when I was ~13? I had grown up with a GameShark on the Gameboy Color, but years later my next exposure to hacking was on the Nintendo DS playing online in Animal Crossing. Had some random person I made friends with on the Nintendo forums join our small group of friends to travel between towns. This person could do some impossible things! They'd dig rivers, spawn-in objects, and I still have a vivid memory of them making the game rain items on balloons like some festive meteor shower.
I remember at that time you'd hear horror stories about hackers coming in and destroying peoples' towns. I did hear about abuse. I liked my (Ukrainian?) friend who would show up and help us make impossible towns with rivers that went in circles and showed us game assets we'd likely never have discovered on our own.
I'm a PC gamer now, and I avoid consoles for the lock-in and control companies like Nintendo exert over its players. I understand why they do it but I feel like the experiences I had could never happen today.
Whoever that was started me on a career of game modding and software development and I'm glad I got to meet them while it was possible.
I ditched them after the way they unceremoniously killed off the Wii U and 3DS Miiverse almost immediately after switch released. Miiverse was a massive part of Wii U's experience, so it was a pretty big punch to the gut when it suddenly went away in 2017. the main menu on Wii U is populated with dozens of randomly chosen miis running around and "discussing" games by displaying speech bubbles with Miiverse posts and it also integrated the Miiverse directly into several games. For the last 8 years that's all been replaced with generic, fake miiverse posts that are hardcoded into the firmware as a fallback for when the internet isn't working. Any game that previously had miiverse functionality lost it in summer 2017, less than five years after the Wii U's release.
Super Mario Maker (September 2015) actually became nigh-unplayable less than two years after its release because it relied on Miiverse to share levels with other players. You can still make your own levels and not share them with anyone, but being able to share your levels online with other players was a significant part of that game.
And that's on top of the fact that anything you buy from Nintendo's many online "eshops"/"shop channels" (there's literally a new online store+account system for every console!) will be destroyed within a decade because they don't think of you as a customer anymore once they have your money.
BTW another great example of how much Nintendo screwed over their most loyal customers: prior to the switch's announcement, preview of Breath of the Wild had a minimap on the Wii U's controller but that was removed in the final release because they didn't want the Wii U version to have an advantage over the Switch port.
I'm not sure it was as massive as people consider if they decided to discontinue it. Any time I checked it was people posting the same 2 "I love games my dad beats me" and "Y can't metroid crawl" memes over and over
There were those but there were also a lot of surprisingly high-effort drawings; Archiverse (https://archiverse.pretendo.network/) has a lot of them archived. It wasn't in any way dead or unpopular.
And if people weren't using it, then why would they backport it to the 3DS three years after release?
And the worst part is, it was still young when they ended it. The Wii U wasn't even five years old and there were still games coming out with miiverse integration a year before it ended. And ultimately Nintendo were the ones who decided to make this into a central feature of their platform. They didn't have to sell people a twitter clone if they didn't even intend to support it for the duration of a single game-console generation. They didn't have to populate the home-menu of the Wii U with miiverse posts or make it central to games like splatoon and mario maker only to end it less than two years from release date.
It shouldn't have been shut down even if there were only 2 people still using it.
I have a fond memory of playing Mario Kart Wii online with my brother when I was a kid, and we ran into into a clearly hacking player who was just constantly spamming items, permanently invincible, etc.
Thankfully hackers weren’t common when I played so it felt like seeing a unicorn in the wild.
Thank you for sharing, both those resonate with me as well.
> Other social media users were quick to reassure Nelson of two things. Firstly, hardware bans received for using second-hand game carts that have been cloned by tools like MIG Flash are not uncommon.
I think the author and I have different definitions of "reassure".
> And, probably more importantly, Nintendo is receptive to owners who can provide corroborating evidence that they are innocent of Nintendo-flavored piracy.
Unless you, say, borrowed a game from a friend who you didn't know bought it from someone who ripped it. Right now it seems they're pretty lax about the "evidence" you bought it, but I'm sure they'll get stricter fast.
> To be clear, if this happens to you, the physical cartridges that you own will remain playable, without updates, and some previously downloaded digital games may remain accessible.
What about game-key cards? (the cartridges that don't contain the game, but a license to download it)
This could reduce the library of games you can play, if they don't let you download the games you purchased.
Switch 2 carts have not been cloned yet, so there is no way to know how nintendo would react.
"Another man who adopted face-eating bird has his face eaten."
I am Jack's complete lack of surprise.
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I bought a digital only PS5 and bought like 6 games for it. I went into it understanding the limitations and like not having to swap out discs. PS5 is just a tiny sliver of my life which is busy and complicated and I’m paying for the simplicity. I’m ok letting go of such a small amount of control.
You don’t NEED video games at all, so it’s kinda moot to say that you don’t NEED the newest “slop”. It’s 100% an entertainment device which is completely unnecessary to life, just like computer games and phone games.
> Just stop giving money to companies that disrespect you, it is that simple, you DON't NEED the latest slop in your life
Well I agree, you don't! Unfortunately, Nintendo produces not slop, but some of the most outstanding games I've ever played (plus a fair bit of slop too).
Myself I don't mind to wait a few years and play on an emulator :)
Nintendo has the best 1st party games. They care a lot about making games that are just fun. What does Valve have? Lootbox, gambling ridden, addictive dopamine juicers. Their offering sucks compared to Nintendo.
Portal and Half-life series will forever be some of my all-time favorite games, but yeah their newer stuff does seem to be not that great, though I'm very much a "play local" kind of guy
Of Valve's offerings, I like Steam the most.
No one is gaming on PC because of "first party" games, and Valve's offerings are literally the whole of Steam with more excellent games you could ever possibly play in a lifetime. Then there's GOG and the other stores. Hell, there are many great games outside any of the major stores. This flimsy excuse only has any sway if all you want to play is the next Mario or Zelda slop, but even then there are emulators.
Nintendo is adamant about destroying our reselling rights. I'll continue skipping this generation.
This is about someone buying a used cart that had been dumped with the MIG Flash mod.
I remember when this MIG mod got released people were saying buying used would now be a roulette as Nintendo can spot the duplicated cart when it is used online and blacklist your switch. Not sure how often it ended up happening, but at least once it seems from this article.
Can't say I'm happy with how Nintendo is dealing with physical games, which means I'll need a really good reason to buy a Switch 2 myself. But Microsoft (and to a lesser extent Sony) are trying harder to kill physical sales and resale.
Nintendo at least have some skin in the game as they have the largest percentage of physical sales compared to Microsoft/Sony.
"Nintendo can spot the duplicated cart."
I think they cannot spot the duplicated cart specifically, they just see the same "cart" (or key) used twice or multiple times at the same time and block it and possibly all devices involved.
Not defending Nintendo, but I believe it is technically impossible for them to distinguish between the pirate and the victim.
How are you so confident about this? It seems like the random YouTube video I saw on this topic [1] had dumped their own games and ran into trouble by using those dumps.
This can't be a new thing, right? For decades there have been entire businesses dedicated to buying and selling hard copies of video games, and online play has been common for at least one decade. I think it's on them to figure out how to make copying hard copies difficult or to distinguish between the legit copy and illicit copies. Banning people for using a legitimate hard copy of a video game because someone else has a illicit copy of it is in no way acceptable.
Yeah, if they were able to directly identified a duplicated cart then the easiest solution would be to update the console software to just not play duplicated carts. There shotgun approach is just biting them in the ass since the market has apparently already been flooded with duplicate carts and all they are doing is antagonizing people who believe they bought in good faith a legitimate game
If they can't distinguish between the pirate and the victim, they shouldn't be punishing either. Banning people for playing legitimately purchased software on an unmodified console is draconian IMO.
That means they're happy to punish the victim. The moral choice would be to punish neither in this case.
It's unclear to me in your comment if you know this so just want to point out that with Switch 2 a lot of the cards are just licenses for a digital download - particularly 3rd party games. 1st party though it looks like they're (currently) putting the whole game on the cards.
Given their obsession with piracy/emulation I wouldn't be surprised to see them completely abandon it in the future and just have the cards be license keys like Sony/M$ currently do. We'll see i suppose.
All they have to do is train an entire generation that reselling games is not a thing, and then it won't matter.
While Nintendo does make good games such as Animal Crossing, their behavior makes me find it hard to support them with my money.
I bought first-gen Nintendo Switch with the faith that maybe I should support the devs for doing nice work, but after getting into the community, I found myself regretting giving my money to wrong hands, it may not be much, but money is money.
You have to give Nintendo credit, they won't give up on trying to solve the unsolvable piracy issue. They're willing to devalue their consoles (meaning their own bottom-line) by crashing game resale value in a mad attempt to stop piracy.
They are not a position where they need to pay huge attention to this - "Nintendo’s Switch 2 is the fastest-selling game console of all time"
Consumer reactions to bad products are often delayed. People will keep buying something until they have a bad experience personally, and then they will switch to something else. Famously you can see this any time a movie franchise releases a bad sequel. People will go to see it, but they will stop watching that franchise from then on.
I sincerely doubt that Nintendo will let the ball drop so much that it impacts sales significantly. They have had numerous occasions when they have been heavy handed with anti-consumer reactions or making decisions that end up hurting customers (like how they never actually fixed the joycon drift), and yet here we are. I'm not holding my breath that boycotts (such as the ones voiced in this thread for example) are actually affecting Nintendo, or will in the future. Legislation is our only choice.
Switch 2 is amazing.
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I don't own a switch or switch 2, but if your account gets banned, does this simply stop you using the online services or does it brick the console?
The former
No. Its the latter in reality. You can't get HOS updates, so nothing new is available.
Your existing games still work, you can install cfw and support any possible game. You just can't play online.
No. Most people are NOT going to be able to install cfw.
Thought about this situation buying used games for the kids and me off Facebook. It’s terrible because I used to trade and buy nes/gameboy and other systems games as a kid. It allowed me to play more games but sometimes you’d get a game that sucked really bad.
Modding is one thing but piracy is another. Nintendo despises both.
The title is technically true, but leaves out the pretty significant context that he has openly used the MIG Switch, a device technically for "backups", but realistically for piracy.
It's within the realm of possibility that you could get in trouble after buying used games which have been the source of pirated copies, but I don't believe that this guy's situation is an example of that happening.
"Nintendo cuts off online access for console after guy uses tool made for piracy" is a less compelling title though.
For anyone who hasn't been following this story, this is misinformation. The user had been playing pirated games on their MIG Switch and when they got banned for it, tried to blame a pre-owned copy of Bayonetta
Is there a breakdown of the timeline anywhere? Everything I've read so far about this happening has been hearsay/speculation.
It’s pretty clear from the article that the ban is due to using a defeat device (which he posted publicly about trying out) and very likely has nothing to do with the game he bought.
No, there are plenty of people who have reported being banned over used games. The article cites another article where the same thing happened (and no, it's not a pirate pretending to be innocent, Nintendo reversed the ban).
Yes, the article states that he was discussing using a defeat device that Nintendo have been actively banning for.
No it genuinely is. Their reddit post history was clearly asking for help with running pirated games
Can this claim be verified?
People buy these consoles even knowing about Nintendo practices, lawsuit after lawsuit worse than Apple.
I'm sorry but I've no sympathy, it's because of people that keep buying broken games and accepting companies policies that the gaming industry is in a shit show status right now.
funny how the internet "features" allows nintendos lawyers grubby hands right into your living room
Switch 2 is a hard pass for me if Nintendo can brick on a whim
Just to be clear, this isn't brick on a whim, this is disabling access to online services on a whim.
Seems a lot of commenters are getting that confused due to not opening the link.
Online Services, including any digital purchases which could be into the hundreds of dollars in value.
Yes, although if one is buying used, then you're likely already avoiding digital purchases through this online service.
So just keep buying used. Pretty easy workaround.
Do we know if it blocks you from downloading "game key" cards? In that case you're effectively stuck with Switch 1 titles. Not that you should need a "workaround" for being punished because someone else did something.
So not being able to download any of the games you have purchased ever again?
Article says you can still play those, just not re-download on the same system it seems.
ah, very reasonable...
While not technically bricking, the restrictions are very heavy, especially considering that you can run into the situation innocently. Buying something with the possibility of this is a risk, and OP is very understandable for not liking this risk.
My current policy is that I simply will not pay money for a game that requires access to online services to function properly.
Agreed, and you shouldn't be downvoted for it, oh well.
I'll handle it like I handled all other Nintendo consoles. I have one for legit use and one that I open up for, er, "alternative" content.
At that point just emulate it on a Steam Deck...
The Steam Deck is more expensive though. And I mostly play the switch docked on the TV.
The Steamdeck is more expensive than buying two Nintento Switch 2s? Theres definitely a dock for the Steamdeck, and you get all your Steam games OOTB, in my case thats hundreds more games than any Switch.
I’ll just give up on them altogether, and patiently wait for simulators I can use instead.
Eh, I tend to like them. The Switch was the console I liked the most since my SNES days.
I am far from heing against piracy, but I can pay, ao I do.
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Yeah, I can wait for emulators instead of spending $500 on something I won't own.
I don't like this practice, and it's one of the primary reasons I'm not buying a Switch 2, but his console wasn't bricked, it was just banned from playing online. And don't trot out that tired old "effectively bricked" line, words have meanings, and the words you said do not mean what happened.
If someone bought it for online play specifically, then there is no difference between being banned from playing online and the console not turning on. You're just nitpicking on the meaning, but we know what happened.
I was trying to recall just how early "Big N" was a nickname for Nintendo, thinking it must have predated the Nintendo 64, but it took a bit of digging to find anything concrete:
My naive first thought was "Captain N: The Game Master" but that wasn't quite "Big N." But it was fun to visit a bunch of old Nintendo-related articles.
It's funny to me because I've never heard anyone refer to Nintendo as "Big N" there's a handful of other things referred to as Big N, Nintendo is not one of them.
I remember it being frequently used as far back as the 80s by Electronic Gaming Monthly
I replied in another thread [1] but this was the earliest thing I could find in online resources, but maybe your recollection would lead to something earlier:
American racists don't get to claim exclusive rights to the letter N.
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Is this IP troll energy pervasive in other Japanese tech companies or is Nintendo an outlier?
This has nothing to do with patent trolling.
Sure... IP rather than patent ~ the vibe reminds me of patent trolls is what I mean. It's the evil of opressive copyright boots on the necks of people simply trying to enjoy themselves.
Why would someone in their right mind ever buy a Nintendo product?
Cool hardware, generally stable experience, family friendly, lots of games which are enriching, the portability is awesome, it’s inexpensive, the games are fun, lots of exclusives…
You couldn’t think of ANY of these?
> You couldn’t think of ANY of these?
There can be a thousand reasons to favour something, yet it only takes one reason to reject it.
As for the inexpensive bit, I've never really viewed Nintendo in that light because the games themselves are rather expensive. For my older DS/3DS it wasn't much of an issue since there was the secondhand market. It sounds like the secondhand market is a gamble with the Switch 2 which, at least in my case, makes it a non-starter. That is especially true since they are punishing the person with the legitimate cartridge, who may or may not have been the person who pirated the game.
Sure, but OP asked why anyone would ever buy one, and all of those alone can be a justification. He didn’t ask “how doesn’t everyone view these problems as a non-starter”. It’s an unbelievably popular and fast-selling console - the entire premise of the question is weird anyways.
> Cool hardware
Eh, from what I've heard it's not really that great. Nintendo isn't really known for cutting edge tech, they're really more known for their first party offering. Steam Deck is a few years old now but still pretty impressive hardware, so I would call them about equal
> generally stable experience
Yes this is true (as long as you don't try to mod), though Steam Deck has been rock solid stable for me
> family friendly
Can you expand on this a bit? Other platforms have family controls and lots of family-friendly game options so I don't know where Nintendo out competes in this area.
> lots of games which are enriching
Aside from the first-party games, this also doesn't feel like a unique quality of Nintendo
> the portability is awesome
I'm assuming you mean physical portability? If so then yes, but also not unique to Nintendo.
If you mean software portability like "can run games on other systems/platforms" then absolutely not. Steam is going to be way better at that.
> it’s inexpensive
Is it? Here at least the switch 2 is $500 (there is one on Amazon for $450 but it is "invite only"), compared with Steam Deck which starts at $400 but goes up to $650 for the top model. It seems like again Nintendo is just not unique in price.
> the games are fun, lots of exclusives…
The exclusives are IMHO really the only reason to get a Nintendo. If you really like their first party games then you have no choice. Everyone I know who bought a Switch (and will buy Switch 2) did it for this reason. To me personally the exclusivity is a major turn-off
You say all that, but the fact that Switch 2 is the fastest selling console ever shows that people disagree.
When has release sales ever been a good indicator of quality? Heck, when have sales in general ever been a reliable indicator of quality?
This thread is related to it being bought, not its quality.
They make excellent games?
This is a gaming console, so for games obviously?
Really, what’s a good alternative to Nintendo? I argue they don’t really have any competition.
If you really want first party games or those with heavy anti-cheat, then yes, but if you just want a handheld console with a great UX, the Steam Deck is phenomenal. The same games are also often way cheaper, plus if you want to play on PC later you can...
Steam deck has very bad battery life, especially when running aa or aaa game.
N=1, but yes, I'm happy enough with Nintendo first and second party titles.
The only reason someone buys any gaming hardware: games are good.
For myself it was my first console bought on pre sale. And here in my country is much more expensive.
Basically I raised the bar tremendously. I have the console, MKW, probably will buy Metroid, probably another Zelda. But that's it. I will not tolerate a low bar.
Now that indies are constantly increasing theirs with more genuine experiences? No no no
I bought NSW2 to be my defacto indie platform as well, but I just reporpused a laptop with Arch/Proton/Steam/Gog and I will work on that.
All my accessories from 8bitdo are working flawlessly, so not even a controller I will buy. I don't even bothered to buy the special SD card they require because I can't see myself using even the internal storage, unlike my NSW1.
I'm also part of the group that was shocked with the changes on MKW as well. A long time Nintendo fan disappointed.
I stayed fan for all this time because the experience hassle free. I don't want another Denuvo strategy, or games becoming boring like many mobile games.
I hope more people realize that there are options out there. Support the indies is my choice.
It's a great console for kids.
They are quite fun!
Great 1st party titles
> Why would someone in their right mind ever buy a Nintendo product?
Correction: Why would someone in their right mind ever buy a Nintendo product and use it accordance within the manufacturer's guidelines?
I purchased a first gen (rcm exploit) switch and I couldn't be happier with my investment.
I'm not concerned about being banned as it is never connected to the internet... for "reasons". :)
even if you do connect it to the internet and get it banned, it probably wouldn't matter if you're not planning on using it with Nintendo's online services anymore
Animal Crossing will forever be a kids game that changed my life profoundly, and twice. Like most of us, Animal Crossing got me through Covid19. It was such a strange time to be locked in and spending 10 hours of every day working on collecting and manicuring your town. I remember my sister and I really bonded over this game, and there were many days where my mom and dad watched us play.
But aside from a worldwide pandemic, I remember the first time Animal Crossing changed my perspective was when I was ~13? I had grown up with a GameShark on the Gameboy Color, but years later my next exposure to hacking was on the Nintendo DS playing online in Animal Crossing. Had some random person I made friends with on the Nintendo forums join our small group of friends to travel between towns. This person could do some impossible things! They'd dig rivers, spawn-in objects, and I still have a vivid memory of them making the game rain items on balloons like some festive meteor shower.
I remember at that time you'd hear horror stories about hackers coming in and destroying peoples' towns. I did hear about abuse. I liked my (Ukrainian?) friend who would show up and help us make impossible towns with rivers that went in circles and showed us game assets we'd likely never have discovered on our own.
I'm a PC gamer now, and I avoid consoles for the lock-in and control companies like Nintendo exert over its players. I understand why they do it but I feel like the experiences I had could never happen today.
Whoever that was started me on a career of game modding and software development and I'm glad I got to meet them while it was possible.
I ditched them after the way they unceremoniously killed off the Wii U and 3DS Miiverse almost immediately after switch released. Miiverse was a massive part of Wii U's experience, so it was a pretty big punch to the gut when it suddenly went away in 2017. the main menu on Wii U is populated with dozens of randomly chosen miis running around and "discussing" games by displaying speech bubbles with Miiverse posts and it also integrated the Miiverse directly into several games. For the last 8 years that's all been replaced with generic, fake miiverse posts that are hardcoded into the firmware as a fallback for when the internet isn't working. Any game that previously had miiverse functionality lost it in summer 2017, less than five years after the Wii U's release.
Super Mario Maker (September 2015) actually became nigh-unplayable less than two years after its release because it relied on Miiverse to share levels with other players. You can still make your own levels and not share them with anyone, but being able to share your levels online with other players was a significant part of that game.
And that's on top of the fact that anything you buy from Nintendo's many online "eshops"/"shop channels" (there's literally a new online store+account system for every console!) will be destroyed within a decade because they don't think of you as a customer anymore once they have your money.
BTW another great example of how much Nintendo screwed over their most loyal customers: prior to the switch's announcement, preview of Breath of the Wild had a minimap on the Wii U's controller but that was removed in the final release because they didn't want the Wii U version to have an advantage over the Switch port.
I'm not sure it was as massive as people consider if they decided to discontinue it. Any time I checked it was people posting the same 2 "I love games my dad beats me" and "Y can't metroid crawl" memes over and over
There were those but there were also a lot of surprisingly high-effort drawings; Archiverse (https://archiverse.pretendo.network/) has a lot of them archived. It wasn't in any way dead or unpopular.
And if people weren't using it, then why would they backport it to the 3DS three years after release?
And the worst part is, it was still young when they ended it. The Wii U wasn't even five years old and there were still games coming out with miiverse integration a year before it ended. And ultimately Nintendo were the ones who decided to make this into a central feature of their platform. They didn't have to sell people a twitter clone if they didn't even intend to support it for the duration of a single game-console generation. They didn't have to populate the home-menu of the Wii U with miiverse posts or make it central to games like splatoon and mario maker only to end it less than two years from release date.
It shouldn't have been shut down even if there were only 2 people still using it.
I have a fond memory of playing Mario Kart Wii online with my brother when I was a kid, and we ran into into a clearly hacking player who was just constantly spamming items, permanently invincible, etc.
Thankfully hackers weren’t common when I played so it felt like seeing a unicorn in the wild.
Thank you for sharing, both those resonate with me as well.
> Other social media users were quick to reassure Nelson of two things. Firstly, hardware bans received for using second-hand game carts that have been cloned by tools like MIG Flash are not uncommon.
I think the author and I have different definitions of "reassure".
> And, probably more importantly, Nintendo is receptive to owners who can provide corroborating evidence that they are innocent of Nintendo-flavored piracy.
Unless you, say, borrowed a game from a friend who you didn't know bought it from someone who ripped it. Right now it seems they're pretty lax about the "evidence" you bought it, but I'm sure they'll get stricter fast.
> To be clear, if this happens to you, the physical cartridges that you own will remain playable, without updates, and some previously downloaded digital games may remain accessible.
What about game-key cards? (the cartridges that don't contain the game, but a license to download it)
This could reduce the library of games you can play, if they don't let you download the games you purchased.
Switch 2 carts have not been cloned yet, so there is no way to know how nintendo would react.
"Another man who adopted face-eating bird has his face eaten."
I am Jack's complete lack of surprise.
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I bought a digital only PS5 and bought like 6 games for it. I went into it understanding the limitations and like not having to swap out discs. PS5 is just a tiny sliver of my life which is busy and complicated and I’m paying for the simplicity. I’m ok letting go of such a small amount of control.
You don’t NEED video games at all, so it’s kinda moot to say that you don’t NEED the newest “slop”. It’s 100% an entertainment device which is completely unnecessary to life, just like computer games and phone games.
> Just stop giving money to companies that disrespect you, it is that simple, you DON't NEED the latest slop in your life
Well I agree, you don't! Unfortunately, Nintendo produces not slop, but some of the most outstanding games I've ever played (plus a fair bit of slop too).
Myself I don't mind to wait a few years and play on an emulator :)
Nintendo has the best 1st party games. They care a lot about making games that are just fun. What does Valve have? Lootbox, gambling ridden, addictive dopamine juicers. Their offering sucks compared to Nintendo.
Portal and Half-life series will forever be some of my all-time favorite games, but yeah their newer stuff does seem to be not that great, though I'm very much a "play local" kind of guy
Of Valve's offerings, I like Steam the most.
No one is gaming on PC because of "first party" games, and Valve's offerings are literally the whole of Steam with more excellent games you could ever possibly play in a lifetime. Then there's GOG and the other stores. Hell, there are many great games outside any of the major stores. This flimsy excuse only has any sway if all you want to play is the next Mario or Zelda slop, but even then there are emulators.
Nintendo is adamant about destroying our reselling rights. I'll continue skipping this generation.
This is about someone buying a used cart that had been dumped with the MIG Flash mod.
I remember when this MIG mod got released people were saying buying used would now be a roulette as Nintendo can spot the duplicated cart when it is used online and blacklist your switch. Not sure how often it ended up happening, but at least once it seems from this article.
Can't say I'm happy with how Nintendo is dealing with physical games, which means I'll need a really good reason to buy a Switch 2 myself. But Microsoft (and to a lesser extent Sony) are trying harder to kill physical sales and resale.
Nintendo at least have some skin in the game as they have the largest percentage of physical sales compared to Microsoft/Sony.
"Nintendo can spot the duplicated cart."
I think they cannot spot the duplicated cart specifically, they just see the same "cart" (or key) used twice or multiple times at the same time and block it and possibly all devices involved.
Not defending Nintendo, but I believe it is technically impossible for them to distinguish between the pirate and the victim.
How are you so confident about this? It seems like the random YouTube video I saw on this topic [1] had dumped their own games and ran into trouble by using those dumps.
[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExgYTA18_vo
This can't be a new thing, right? For decades there have been entire businesses dedicated to buying and selling hard copies of video games, and online play has been common for at least one decade. I think it's on them to figure out how to make copying hard copies difficult or to distinguish between the legit copy and illicit copies. Banning people for using a legitimate hard copy of a video game because someone else has a illicit copy of it is in no way acceptable.
Yeah, if they were able to directly identified a duplicated cart then the easiest solution would be to update the console software to just not play duplicated carts. There shotgun approach is just biting them in the ass since the market has apparently already been flooded with duplicate carts and all they are doing is antagonizing people who believe they bought in good faith a legitimate game
If they can't distinguish between the pirate and the victim, they shouldn't be punishing either. Banning people for playing legitimately purchased software on an unmodified console is draconian IMO.
That means they're happy to punish the victim. The moral choice would be to punish neither in this case.
It's unclear to me in your comment if you know this so just want to point out that with Switch 2 a lot of the cards are just licenses for a digital download - particularly 3rd party games. 1st party though it looks like they're (currently) putting the whole game on the cards.
Given their obsession with piracy/emulation I wouldn't be surprised to see them completely abandon it in the future and just have the cards be license keys like Sony/M$ currently do. We'll see i suppose.
All they have to do is train an entire generation that reselling games is not a thing, and then it won't matter.
While Nintendo does make good games such as Animal Crossing, their behavior makes me find it hard to support them with my money.
I bought first-gen Nintendo Switch with the faith that maybe I should support the devs for doing nice work, but after getting into the community, I found myself regretting giving my money to wrong hands, it may not be much, but money is money.
You have to give Nintendo credit, they won't give up on trying to solve the unsolvable piracy issue. They're willing to devalue their consoles (meaning their own bottom-line) by crashing game resale value in a mad attempt to stop piracy.
They are not a position where they need to pay huge attention to this - "Nintendo’s Switch 2 is the fastest-selling game console of all time"
https://www.theverge.com/news/685162/nintendo-switch-2-sales...
Consumer reactions to bad products are often delayed. People will keep buying something until they have a bad experience personally, and then they will switch to something else. Famously you can see this any time a movie franchise releases a bad sequel. People will go to see it, but they will stop watching that franchise from then on.
I sincerely doubt that Nintendo will let the ball drop so much that it impacts sales significantly. They have had numerous occasions when they have been heavy handed with anti-consumer reactions or making decisions that end up hurting customers (like how they never actually fixed the joycon drift), and yet here we are. I'm not holding my breath that boycotts (such as the ones voiced in this thread for example) are actually affecting Nintendo, or will in the future. Legislation is our only choice.
Switch 2 is amazing.
I don't own a switch or switch 2, but if your account gets banned, does this simply stop you using the online services or does it brick the console?
The former
No. Its the latter in reality. You can't get HOS updates, so nothing new is available.
Your existing games still work, you can install cfw and support any possible game. You just can't play online.
No. Most people are NOT going to be able to install cfw.
Thought about this situation buying used games for the kids and me off Facebook. It’s terrible because I used to trade and buy nes/gameboy and other systems games as a kid. It allowed me to play more games but sometimes you’d get a game that sucked really bad.
Modding is one thing but piracy is another. Nintendo despises both.
The title is technically true, but leaves out the pretty significant context that he has openly used the MIG Switch, a device technically for "backups", but realistically for piracy.
It's within the realm of possibility that you could get in trouble after buying used games which have been the source of pirated copies, but I don't believe that this guy's situation is an example of that happening.
"Nintendo cuts off online access for console after guy uses tool made for piracy" is a less compelling title though.
For anyone who hasn't been following this story, this is misinformation. The user had been playing pirated games on their MIG Switch and when they got banned for it, tried to blame a pre-owned copy of Bayonetta
Is there a breakdown of the timeline anywhere? Everything I've read so far about this happening has been hearsay/speculation.
It’s pretty clear from the article that the ban is due to using a defeat device (which he posted publicly about trying out) and very likely has nothing to do with the game he bought.
No, there are plenty of people who have reported being banned over used games. The article cites another article where the same thing happened (and no, it's not a pirate pretending to be innocent, Nintendo reversed the ban).
Yes, the article states that he was discussing using a defeat device that Nintendo have been actively banning for.
No it genuinely is. Their reddit post history was clearly asking for help with running pirated games
Can this claim be verified?
People buy these consoles even knowing about Nintendo practices, lawsuit after lawsuit worse than Apple.
I'm sorry but I've no sympathy, it's because of people that keep buying broken games and accepting companies policies that the gaming industry is in a shit show status right now.
funny how the internet "features" allows nintendos lawyers grubby hands right into your living room
Switch 2 is a hard pass for me if Nintendo can brick on a whim
Just to be clear, this isn't brick on a whim, this is disabling access to online services on a whim.
Seems a lot of commenters are getting that confused due to not opening the link.
Online Services, including any digital purchases which could be into the hundreds of dollars in value.
Yes, although if one is buying used, then you're likely already avoiding digital purchases through this online service.
So just keep buying used. Pretty easy workaround.
Do we know if it blocks you from downloading "game key" cards? In that case you're effectively stuck with Switch 1 titles. Not that you should need a "workaround" for being punished because someone else did something.
So not being able to download any of the games you have purchased ever again?
Article says you can still play those, just not re-download on the same system it seems.
ah, very reasonable...
While not technically bricking, the restrictions are very heavy, especially considering that you can run into the situation innocently. Buying something with the possibility of this is a risk, and OP is very understandable for not liking this risk.
My current policy is that I simply will not pay money for a game that requires access to online services to function properly.
Agreed, and you shouldn't be downvoted for it, oh well.
I'll handle it like I handled all other Nintendo consoles. I have one for legit use and one that I open up for, er, "alternative" content.
At that point just emulate it on a Steam Deck...
The Steam Deck is more expensive though. And I mostly play the switch docked on the TV.
The Steamdeck is more expensive than buying two Nintento Switch 2s? Theres definitely a dock for the Steamdeck, and you get all your Steam games OOTB, in my case thats hundreds more games than any Switch.
I’ll just give up on them altogether, and patiently wait for simulators I can use instead.
Eh, I tend to like them. The Switch was the console I liked the most since my SNES days.
I am far from heing against piracy, but I can pay, ao I do.
Yeah, I can wait for emulators instead of spending $500 on something I won't own.
I don't like this practice, and it's one of the primary reasons I'm not buying a Switch 2, but his console wasn't bricked, it was just banned from playing online. And don't trot out that tired old "effectively bricked" line, words have meanings, and the words you said do not mean what happened.
If someone bought it for online play specifically, then there is no difference between being banned from playing online and the console not turning on. You're just nitpicking on the meaning, but we know what happened.
[dead]
>got flagged by big N
Big N, really?
"Big N" is an older term from Nintendo. Think the giant rotating "N" from the Nintendo 64 logo. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nb-h4oLctQc
I was trying to recall just how early "Big N" was a nickname for Nintendo, thinking it must have predated the Nintendo 64, but it took a bit of digging to find anything concrete:
https://archive.org/details/run-magazine-87/page/n17/mode/1u...
My naive first thought was "Captain N: The Game Master" but that wasn't quite "Big N." But it was fun to visit a bunch of old Nintendo-related articles.
It's funny to me because I've never heard anyone refer to Nintendo as "Big N" there's a handful of other things referred to as Big N, Nintendo is not one of them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_N
"Nickname for Nintendo"
I remember it being frequently used as far back as the 80s by Electronic Gaming Monthly
I replied in another thread [1] but this was the earliest thing I could find in online resources, but maybe your recollection would lead to something earlier:
https://archive.org/details/run-magazine-87/page/n17/mode/1u...
[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44601355
American racists don't get to claim exclusive rights to the letter N.
[flagged]
Is this IP troll energy pervasive in other Japanese tech companies or is Nintendo an outlier?
This has nothing to do with patent trolling.
Sure... IP rather than patent ~ the vibe reminds me of patent trolls is what I mean. It's the evil of opressive copyright boots on the necks of people simply trying to enjoy themselves.
Why would someone in their right mind ever buy a Nintendo product?
Cool hardware, generally stable experience, family friendly, lots of games which are enriching, the portability is awesome, it’s inexpensive, the games are fun, lots of exclusives…
You couldn’t think of ANY of these?
> You couldn’t think of ANY of these?
There can be a thousand reasons to favour something, yet it only takes one reason to reject it.
As for the inexpensive bit, I've never really viewed Nintendo in that light because the games themselves are rather expensive. For my older DS/3DS it wasn't much of an issue since there was the secondhand market. It sounds like the secondhand market is a gamble with the Switch 2 which, at least in my case, makes it a non-starter. That is especially true since they are punishing the person with the legitimate cartridge, who may or may not have been the person who pirated the game.
Sure, but OP asked why anyone would ever buy one, and all of those alone can be a justification. He didn’t ask “how doesn’t everyone view these problems as a non-starter”. It’s an unbelievably popular and fast-selling console - the entire premise of the question is weird anyways.
> Cool hardware
Eh, from what I've heard it's not really that great. Nintendo isn't really known for cutting edge tech, they're really more known for their first party offering. Steam Deck is a few years old now but still pretty impressive hardware, so I would call them about equal
> generally stable experience
Yes this is true (as long as you don't try to mod), though Steam Deck has been rock solid stable for me
> family friendly
Can you expand on this a bit? Other platforms have family controls and lots of family-friendly game options so I don't know where Nintendo out competes in this area.
> lots of games which are enriching
Aside from the first-party games, this also doesn't feel like a unique quality of Nintendo
> the portability is awesome
I'm assuming you mean physical portability? If so then yes, but also not unique to Nintendo.
If you mean software portability like "can run games on other systems/platforms" then absolutely not. Steam is going to be way better at that.
> it’s inexpensive
Is it? Here at least the switch 2 is $500 (there is one on Amazon for $450 but it is "invite only"), compared with Steam Deck which starts at $400 but goes up to $650 for the top model. It seems like again Nintendo is just not unique in price.
> the games are fun, lots of exclusives…
The exclusives are IMHO really the only reason to get a Nintendo. If you really like their first party games then you have no choice. Everyone I know who bought a Switch (and will buy Switch 2) did it for this reason. To me personally the exclusivity is a major turn-off
You say all that, but the fact that Switch 2 is the fastest selling console ever shows that people disagree.
When has release sales ever been a good indicator of quality? Heck, when have sales in general ever been a reliable indicator of quality?
This thread is related to it being bought, not its quality.
They make excellent games?
This is a gaming console, so for games obviously?
Really, what’s a good alternative to Nintendo? I argue they don’t really have any competition.
If you really want first party games or those with heavy anti-cheat, then yes, but if you just want a handheld console with a great UX, the Steam Deck is phenomenal. The same games are also often way cheaper, plus if you want to play on PC later you can...
Steam deck has very bad battery life, especially when running aa or aaa game.
N=1, but yes, I'm happy enough with Nintendo first and second party titles.
The only reason someone buys any gaming hardware: games are good.
For myself it was my first console bought on pre sale. And here in my country is much more expensive.
Basically I raised the bar tremendously. I have the console, MKW, probably will buy Metroid, probably another Zelda. But that's it. I will not tolerate a low bar.
Now that indies are constantly increasing theirs with more genuine experiences? No no no
I bought NSW2 to be my defacto indie platform as well, but I just reporpused a laptop with Arch/Proton/Steam/Gog and I will work on that.
All my accessories from 8bitdo are working flawlessly, so not even a controller I will buy. I don't even bothered to buy the special SD card they require because I can't see myself using even the internal storage, unlike my NSW1.
I'm also part of the group that was shocked with the changes on MKW as well. A long time Nintendo fan disappointed.
I stayed fan for all this time because the experience hassle free. I don't want another Denuvo strategy, or games becoming boring like many mobile games.
I hope more people realize that there are options out there. Support the indies is my choice.
It's a great console for kids.
They are quite fun!
Great 1st party titles
> Why would someone in their right mind ever buy a Nintendo product?
Correction: Why would someone in their right mind ever buy a Nintendo product and use it accordance within the manufacturer's guidelines?
I purchased a first gen (rcm exploit) switch and I couldn't be happier with my investment.
I'm not concerned about being banned as it is never connected to the internet... for "reasons". :)
even if you do connect it to the internet and get it banned, it probably wouldn't matter if you're not planning on using it with Nintendo's online services anymore