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A Remarkable Assertion from A16Z

I wish I had as many positive experience as it seems some other HNers have with LLMs. I'm not saying I've had zero positive experiences but the number of negative experiences is so high that it's just super scary.

Yesterday, Thanksgiving, there was a Google Doodle. Clicking the doodle lead to a Gemini prompt for how to plan to have Thanksgiving dinner ready on time. It had a schedule for lots of prep the day before and then a timeline for the day of. It had cooking the dinner rolls and then said something like "take them out and keep them warm" followed by cooking something else in the oven. I asked "How do I keep them warm when something else is cooking in the oven?". It proceeded to give me a revised timeline that contradicted its original timeline and also, made no sense in and of itself. I asked it about the contradiction and the error and it apologized and gave a completely new 3rd timeline that was different than the first 2 and also nonsense. This was Google's Gemini Promotion!

All it really needed to do to my first query was say something like "put a towel over the rolls" and leave it on top of the oven.... Maybe? But then, it had told me be spread butter over the rolls as soon as they came out of the oven so I'd have asked, "won't the towel suck up all the butter?"

This is one example many times LLMs fail me (ChatGPT, Gemini). For direct code gen, my subjective experience is it fails 5 of 6 times. For stackoverflow type questions it succeeds 5 of 6 times. For non-code questions it depends on the type of question. But, when it fails it fails so badly that I'm somewhat surprised it ever works.

And yea, the whole world is running head first into massive LLM usage like this one using it for short reviews of authors. Ugh!!!

5 minutes agosocalgal2

Since the commit history is public, there's a much easier way to tell that AI had a hand in writing that list.

https://github.com/a16z-infra/reading-list/commit/93bc3abb04...

> opus descriptions in cursor, raw

4 hours agojsheard

That version is more sensible. Opus generated:

> Warning: his endings are notoriously abrupt, like a segfault in the middle of your favorite function.

In commit e4d022[0], the wording changed to:

> Fair warning: most of these books famously don't have endings (they literally stop mid-sentence during a normal plot arc).

It's unclear what led to that change, as the commit message is just "stephenson".

It went through a few more minor edits to get to what's currently published.

https://github.com/a16z-infra/reading-list/commit/e4d022d592...

3 hours agomtlynch

matt-bornstein's commits in that repo do often start off with ai-generated descriptions which he then edits down. there are notes on some commits that say things like "AI GENERATED NEED TO EDIT". the other contributors' changes don't have these tells.

while it should come as no surprise to have software written by llms, if these books are in fact just picked by llms then what's the point of this list?

3 hours agoilikehurdles

I don’t see any evidence the LLM picked the list of books, it instead was used to update/add descriptions of the books and series.

3 hours agocowsandmilk

That's almost more damning. The list was created by humans, who presumably read the books, but then couldn't be bothered to summarize the very books they read? Either the human is really lazy ("read" the book but can't be bothered to write a short summary) or really really lazy (didn't read the book but felt a summary was necessary). Either way, it makes this list less interesting, at the very least because it doesn't need to exist at all if someone can just ask an LLM "list and describe books that A16Z might think are valuable to read" and get the same quality output.

3 minutes agothwarted

   Stephenson doesn't just write sci-fi, he writes operating manuals for the future. His books predicted cryptocurrency, the metaverse, and distributed computing before most of us knew what TCP/IP stood for. Warning: his endings are notoriously abrupt, like a segfault in the middle of your favorite function.
This really is a study in AI slop. At least they had the good sense to change it.
4 hours agoandy99

Man... "Write a book recommendation for people who like The Big Bang Theory".

an hour agonetsharc

I’m gonna start thinking “Bazinga!” every time someone says something borderline ai-sloppy

10 minutes agobinary132

When they changed it is also when they misspelled his name. Opus got it right. I was surprised Stephenson took the misspelling as an AI tell.

3 hours agoabecedarius

To a version that managed to typo his name.

2 hours agophilipwhiuk

How did his books PREDICT crypto when we had eCash way before any of his books? SMH.

4 hours agonakamoto_damacy

Most of his books are also dystopias, not operating manuals.

3 hours agoagentultra

a16z seems to view turning society into a dystopia as a goal, so that makes sense. Their portfolio includes:

- DoubleSpeed, a bot farm as a service provider, allowing customers to orchestrate social media activity across thousands of fake accounts to create artificial consensus on the topic of their choice. Never pay a human again!

- Cheddr, the TikTok of sports gambling, whose differentiating feature is allowing users under 21. Place live in-game bets with just a swipe!

- Coverd, a new type of credit card where you can wipe off bills by betting on your favorite gambling games in their app. No VPN required!

3 hours agondiddy

Wow, I just checked the doublespeed website and it is comically evil. The footer says — verbatim, and in huge letters — "never pay a human again." (I'm not selectively quoting; it's a full sentence, despite their weird capitalization.)

If Neal Stephenson tried to write a villain this on-the-nose, his editor would tell him to tone it down.

an hour agojakelazaroff

> Cheddr

> Coverd

Even worse, they're bringing Web 2.0 startup names back...

2 hours agojsheard

Can A16Z tell the difference? Insert that meme "At long last, we have created the Torment Nexus, from the classic sci-fi novel, Don't Create the Torment Nexus".

3 hours agorainsford

a16z and others like them never met a dystopian warning they didn't interpret as a titillating invitation to an uncomfortably exciting and inevitable future!

3 hours agocmrdporcupine

Yeah, which book are we talking about? Reamde features crypto heavily, but I remember having bitcoins at the time it came out.

an hour agoefnx

I imagine this is intended (though if it's AI-generated "intended" doesn't really apply) as a reference 1999's Cryptonomicon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptonomicon

From that Wikipedia summary:

> Their goal is to facilitate anonymous Internet banking using electronic money and (later) digital gold currency

an hour agosimonw
[deleted]
4 hours ago

Keep this in mind if you _ever_ feel tempted to take A16Z seriously. Absolute charlatans and clowns.

4 hours agosimianparrot

Software is eating the world.

AI is eating the VCs.

3 hours agohobofan

MLaaS (money laundering as a service)

7 minutes agobinary132

We know that being a billionaire surrounded by yes-men all day causes brain damage, and we know that being on social media living in a delusion bubble all day causes brain damage, so really they were already cooked even before signing what was left of their brains over to the LLMs.

3 hours agokibwen

...and a conehead.

3 hours agoDonHopkins

It's such an interesting arc. I starting university in Sept '94, super excited to try out Mosaic on a T1 class connection after suffering through my 14.4k home modem. And shortly after I arrived, Netscape dropped.

He was an absolute hero of that era, possibly the most admired 'geek' back then. Young, with hair, with no hints of his future Dr. Evil emergence.

an hour agobrandall10

Of course the irony ist that if a big corporation publishes a year-end reading list, it has the implicit message of "hey we are not just a group of boring corporate robots - we're people, with real feelings, and hobbies like reading, and taste."

And now we realize that this is just a PR charade. They might not be people with hobbies like reading, and taste.

2 hours agoCoeur

Reminds me of Werner Herzog's autobiography. In the introduction, he muses on a life being cut short by a snipers bullet, and when he sees a bird flying past his window as he is writing his book makes him imagine it is a bullet and he thinks it would be a nice device to cut his final chapter short at that exact moment, so he is giving fair warning that the book will end abruptly.

And so it does, but in a totally Herzog moment he then almost immediately intones afterwards "and that is the end of the book as I indicated in the foreword".

2 hours agofeintruled

It would have been really great to end the blog post mid-sentence.

5 hours agokylecazar

I don't have any original ideas

4 hours agofnord77
[deleted]
3 hours ago

Lol I was hoping for that too

3 hours agopstoll

um, it literally does

4 hours agoruined

I'm really curious whats going on here. Is this a joke? Are you ok?

4 hours agojeremyjh
[deleted]
2 hours ago

did you even read the article??

4 hours agoruined

I don't appreciate these kinds of simple one-line referential jokes on HN, but your joke was to emulate perfectly the central issue of TFA, so I do agree that it brings into question who did and who did not read the article -- I know you read it.

4 hours agodundarious
[deleted]
4 hours ago

[flagged]

4 hours agonchmy

E-mail the staff (link in the footer). Either dang or tomhow will reply, and they take these seriously and can take action.

4 hours agolatexr
[deleted]
4 hours ago

no,it quite literally doesnt...

4 hours agonchmy

The central complaint of TFA is the exact same as what ruined is doing. It is very obviously a joke. Not something I appreciate on HN, but still.

4 hours agodundarious

I think it was a good enough joke or witty remark grounded in the crux of the article that it’s worth it. And it’s certainly interesting to see the “whoosh” past many of the commenters

3 hours agoandy99

It was flagged and I vouched it for similar reasons. I downvote such comments though.

3 hours agodundarious
[deleted]
4 hours ago

a remarkable assertion from nchmy

4 hours agoruined

whoosh

an hour agonatch
[deleted]
4 hours ago

It's definitely written by an AI. The end description of hitchhikers guide is "[...]the meaning of life. Which turns out to be an integer." No one would bother writing that.

3 hours agoqoez

All of the descriptions on that reading list give me strong LLM vibes. Which, given the source, seems like it should be expected. This post could have stopped after hypothesis 1.

4 hours agohoistbypetard

I agree it is not really controversial, I don't think any other explanation is credible. And it really calls into question their assertion that at least one person there has read every book on the list. They love these books, yet no one there cared enough to write a few sentences about them?

4 hours agojeremyjh

well, maybe no one felt informed enough to write this, so it was outsourced to the llm (imposter syndrom) or it was pure laziness.

3 hours agozurfer

The trick is that this list of books amounts to nerd shibboleths. It's not important to have read them so much as be able to use them as a marker of being a smart person.

(That isn't to say these aren't good books, I'm talking about their social function among a certain type of person, corporation or natural)

2 hours agoroywiggins

He has my admiration, I wouldn't have been able to write an article like this and resist the urge to end it mid

3 hours agodandellion

Maybe he decided to up the ante and name his upcoming novel Candlejack, just to sp

3 hours agoairstrike
[deleted]
3 hours ago

Hypothesis C: failure of human memory. A human read Stephenson's book(s) 20 years ago, remembers that the endings were a bit unsatisfying. The same human also read some other book many years ago, which ends mid-sentence. In that person's mind, the two are conflated.

5 hours agod_burfoot

If I was writing a book review for my company (big famous VC who cares about their reputation) - I would’ve probably at least popped the book open and read a few chapters if it’s been years since I read it

3 hours agocoffeebeqn

Hypothesis A is much more likely if you ask me

5 hours agoboesboes

It's A16Z, they definitely had an LLM recommend a set of books that nobody there has actually ever read. Except maybe Snowcrash

5 hours agoshortrounddev2

Hypothesis D-for-Delany: The human thought Stephenson wrote Dhalgren.

"Waiting here, away from the terrifying weaponry, out of the halls of vapor and light, beyond holland into the hills, I have come to"

4 hours agoeesmith

Stephenson? Ah yes, the deservedly obscure dadaist prose stylist who thought it was cool to stop his books mid-sentence.

5 hours agochucksmash

> A hundred years from now, thanks to the workings of the Inhuman Centipede, I’m known as a deservedly obscure dadaist prose stylist who thought it was cool to stop his books mid-sentence.

4 hours agoandrelaszlo

I love the "Inhuman Centipede" definition for AI. Is that a Stephenson original or he is quoting existing usage.

3 hours agogpderetta

The list is clearly mostly machine generated but the name typo is an unlikely error for LLM to make. I'm guessing the "general editing pass" that introduced it was done by an actual human while trying to make the text flow better (less LLM-like).

https://github.com/a16z-infra/reading-list/commit/f8d149495a...

2 hours agoandriamanitra

I've seen LLMs claim that a text cuts off mid-sentence before in cases where it in fact doesn't, and I think this might be an artifact of them being presented with a truncated version by some unclear software process, perhaps to fit into a context window. In this case, however, it's unlikely that the LLM was presented the text directly, and rather it is recounting things it “knows”.

2 hours agoTazeTSchnitzel

Wished he'd spend as much as effort on writing endings for his books as on that blog post.

Sorry. Just grumpy, cause I always love the first 80% of his books and then they somehow... just disintegrate.

3 hours agowarpspin

i didn’t want to be bothered with the shift key so i stopped using it and called it culture. but now i don’t even have to finish my

4 hours agoWaterluvian

Stephenson’s endings are fine.

3 hours agogenghisjahn

due to constant mis-use like this, literally has even been redefined to not necessarily mean its primary definition https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/literally

an hour agorsanek

How is it misuse? This is how words are used - people use turns of phrase and metaphors, and then popular metaphors become secondary meanings. Very popular secondary meanings can even become grammar pieces - like "very", which has become the most standard intensifier, but used to be a normal adverb, like literally and truly.

37 minutes agotsimionescu

In these modern times of ours, the word literally has taken on a new meaning, which is "not literally but with emphasis." This seems like the most likely explanation.

5 hours agoreadams

Even if that's the intended meaning of literally, it is still a reckless exaggeration. I'm pretty sure that Stephenson's endings are no more abrupt than some of Shakespeare's (check out Hamlet and Macbeth) or some of Frank Herbert's (see Dune and Children of Dune), and I never hear anyone go out of their way to describe either of them as being unable to write endings.

5 hours agoEdwardCoffin

Everything from Stephenson after Anathem is an unremitting slog. He needs an editor who won't back down from telling him he needs to cut a third of his pages.

4 hours agohnmullany

Reamde and Fall are quite readable. But what does this have to do with endings?

4 hours agojeremyjh

Remade was snappy but Fall went on forever.

2 hours agojonfromsf

> some of Frank Herbert's (see Dune and Children of Dune),

I mean, Dune does in fact end mid-story, which is probably worse.

4 hours agodisgruntledphd2

No, no it doesn't. Are you talking about the recent movies that split the first novel into two movies? The novel Dune ends after Paul defeats his enemies and becomes emperor.

4 hours agojeremyjh

The Dune series has six novels, the final one is Chapter House Dune, which does in fact end mid story.

I know this because I read them in the 90s and didn't realise that Frank Herbert was dead for quite some time after reading Chapter House.

4 hours agodisgruntledphd2

I know that, I've read them too. In the SP, and in this thread we're discussing endings to novels. No one is complaining about a series that isn't finished due to the author's death.

4 hours agojeremyjh

Hence my comment, "which is probably worse".

2 hours agodisgruntledphd2

I interpret the sense of "literally" here in the opposite way, i.e. without it the sentence may be taken to mean that the books metaphorically stop mid-sentence, but with it, they're saying that it's non-metaphorical and they really do. It would be bizarre wording otherwise.

5 hours agohowenterprisey

“Literally” is commonly used as emphasis, but not as hyperbole. So it’s still a misleading misrepresentation just the same.

5 hours agolayer8

literally

4 hours agofnord77

Hard to believe this when it's such a cut and dry claim about text. What does exaggeration even imply in that context?

5 hours agoMangoToupe

“A hundred years from now, thanks to the workings of the Inhuman Centipede, I’m known as a deservedly obscure dadaist prose stylist who thought it was cool to stop his books mid-sentence.”

is “Inhuman Centipede” to describe the slop-eating-its-own-tale future we all dread an established term, or an invention of the author? I hope it becomes the term we all use, like slop and clanker.

For those of us writing original words that are consumed by LLMs without our consent, at least we get to be the front of the Inhuman Centipede.

5 hours ago3rodents

I strongly suspect that the term alludes to "human centipede", which is a dutch horror film and involves the titular centipede literally eating his own shit.

4 hours agomyrmidon
[deleted]
3 hours ago

Not sure if the substitution of ‘tale’ for ‘tail’ was intentional but regardless it’s apropos

4 hours agodoctorhandshake

Sssh, Neal. They’ll do to you what they did to Michael O. Ch

40 minutes agoblock97

It's the same guys who get impressed if you are playing a video game while talking to them.

4 hours agodude250711

The most likely option of all was the article was written without that much effort by a random employee. This is a lot of work over one throwaway sentence lol.

3 hours agocm2012

How on earth could you think the most likely option is that a human wrote that sentence on purpose? It's not the type of wrong that comes from low effort levels, it's the type of wrong that comes from not being a human.

3 hours agohappytoexplain

Humans make that error all the time. They can hear the author has abrupt endings and write it down. I think this case it actually was AI (according to some other HN comment) but you don't need to be an AI to make this error.

2 hours agocm2012

I thought it was a joke? Like the reviewer is saying, "I didn't finish these books".

2 hours agosyllogism

Missed chance to end the article mid sentence

2 hours agogramakri2
[deleted]
5 hours ago

a16z is such a joke. Prototype of people with no taste and way too much money.

2 hours agorefulgentis
[deleted]
4 hours ago

When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time.

— Maya Angelou

3 hours agoexasperaited

Silicon Valley is largely illiterate when it comes to fiction and literature. It is generally pretty hard to find people who read or think about anything other than a small set of standardized scifi, so even if this wasn't ai slop, it would still be pretty bad.

3 hours agomartythemaniak

Could be some very dry humor? Confused LLM seems most likely though.

5 hours agouxp100

He should have ended this essay mid-sencence, because that would