My whole professional life I have lived in a world where business was done in most of the world-- more or less-- according to American rules of law and trade. I have benefitted enormously from being able to buy things from all over the world when they are cheaper and sell the things I make to most of the world.
I have family members who think America should be first. They love it when the US snubs other countries. In general they are people who are retired, work for the state or local government, or don't do things that generate much wealth. So they are really oblivious to how the world order has benefited their country. But maybe that is because I benefited and they didn't.
Doesnt matter what they think. Go check the headlines in British or French news papers from pinnacle of Empire to unravelling and the level of ignorance and cluelessness will be staggering. The chimp troupe has 3 inch chimp brains to process reality. That brain has hard limits on how much info and change it can process and how quickly it can update existing beliefs. In groups beliefs these update rates and limits slow processing down even further. So incoherence is the norm and story tellung is the survival hack. Once you get that you stop focusing energy and time on the unpredictable and uncontrollable.
> America should be first
America had been first all the time since at least 1945 while driving the globalizaton. What can be more "first" than extracting all possible kinds of value - cheap labor, educated immigrants, mineral resources, transaction fee from whatever goes through the financial networks, profit from the global trade flow, etc. - from the rest of the world?
>But maybe that is because I benefited and they didn't.
"didn't"? Having one of the best retirements in the world immediately comes to mind.
MAGA is about mythically great 50s or 60s i guess. Back then the technological complexity of the time allowed to have "in-house" all the technologies needed to build even most complex products. Today the "house of 340 million" is too small to fit all the tech needed for even moderately complex modern products. The tech pyramid became much higher and has much wider foundation. As a result, tariffs hit most strongly the domestic manufacturing which needs all those imported components/materials.
I think we agree! My point was that America was first, but you only saw that if you were doing business at a corporate level, particularly in things like tech or finance. If you lived in a small town, you saw your manufacturing shut down. If you lived in a big city you knew people who were doing business all over the world with great success.
And also I agree that the whole country benefited economically. But its hard to see that when your region is doing badly.
>But its hard to see that when your region is doing badly.
May be proponents of globalism should have financed those voters travel to other countries to see what real "doing badly" looks like.
In US, as far as i see, whenever/wherever somebody is struggling, doing badly, it can mostly be attributed to 2 problems - 30 or something years stagnant minimum wage, which today is several times less than minimally reasonable, and tremendous limitations on housing construction, both problems are inflicted by politicians on the regular people.
Billionaires and farmers selling abroad love this administration. The small enterpreneurs and wall street voted for it the most.
Back during the first "America First", there was a series of satire videos titled "America First ${COUNTRY} Second".
They're somewhat dated now, but still informative if you're curious about the rest of the world.
"Netherlands Second" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-xxis7hDOE was I believe the first second, but not only other european countries but many others globally (as well as a few regions and fictional countries) eventually produced one, easily found on YT.
Pedantry: not just the Spaniards.. they made the English pay too?
That was pretty much always the point of America First. Put on your own mask before assisting others.
Unfortunately, the US has so many current problems it needs to work out that America First means America Alone until then. Unfortunately, I don't envision any of said problems being solved in any way.
I don't see any problem-solving being done, I only see the US dismantling the world it created, where - let's not kid ourselves - America always came first. The problems the US faces would be better solved with international cooperation, but the US is flushing its softpower down the toilet and destroying all goodwill amongst its allies.
This is not true. America first is not focusing on self, it is going out if its way to harm democracies out of it and create white ethnostate inside.
The US are having their split from the world, cleaved from within moment; all driven by a nominal desire to be great again.
Future history lessons on these moments in time will be interesting.
f*ck around and find out is my assumption of what they meant.
Mine also - worthy of note is currently those ouside the US are responding to US actions with FAFO, at the same time those within the US are responding to Federal overreach with the same attitude, hence the repurposing of the FLA (Four Letter Acronym).
What do you mean, concretely?
It seems to me like other countries are cautiously responding to threats of invasion and sudden tariffs. They did not wake up one day and randomly decided to divest from the United States.
The government overreach part I cannot comment on. From my limited point of view I see ICE and overturning Roe vs Wade, but I don't pay attention to US domestic politics.
My whole professional life I have lived in a world where business was done in most of the world-- more or less-- according to American rules of law and trade. I have benefitted enormously from being able to buy things from all over the world when they are cheaper and sell the things I make to most of the world.
I have family members who think America should be first. They love it when the US snubs other countries. In general they are people who are retired, work for the state or local government, or don't do things that generate much wealth. So they are really oblivious to how the world order has benefited their country. But maybe that is because I benefited and they didn't.
Doesnt matter what they think. Go check the headlines in British or French news papers from pinnacle of Empire to unravelling and the level of ignorance and cluelessness will be staggering. The chimp troupe has 3 inch chimp brains to process reality. That brain has hard limits on how much info and change it can process and how quickly it can update existing beliefs. In groups beliefs these update rates and limits slow processing down even further. So incoherence is the norm and story tellung is the survival hack. Once you get that you stop focusing energy and time on the unpredictable and uncontrollable.
> America should be first
America had been first all the time since at least 1945 while driving the globalizaton. What can be more "first" than extracting all possible kinds of value - cheap labor, educated immigrants, mineral resources, transaction fee from whatever goes through the financial networks, profit from the global trade flow, etc. - from the rest of the world?
>But maybe that is because I benefited and they didn't.
"didn't"? Having one of the best retirements in the world immediately comes to mind.
MAGA is about mythically great 50s or 60s i guess. Back then the technological complexity of the time allowed to have "in-house" all the technologies needed to build even most complex products. Today the "house of 340 million" is too small to fit all the tech needed for even moderately complex modern products. The tech pyramid became much higher and has much wider foundation. As a result, tariffs hit most strongly the domestic manufacturing which needs all those imported components/materials.
I think we agree! My point was that America was first, but you only saw that if you were doing business at a corporate level, particularly in things like tech or finance. If you lived in a small town, you saw your manufacturing shut down. If you lived in a big city you knew people who were doing business all over the world with great success.
And also I agree that the whole country benefited economically. But its hard to see that when your region is doing badly.
>But its hard to see that when your region is doing badly.
May be proponents of globalism should have financed those voters travel to other countries to see what real "doing badly" looks like.
In US, as far as i see, whenever/wherever somebody is struggling, doing badly, it can mostly be attributed to 2 problems - 30 or something years stagnant minimum wage, which today is several times less than minimally reasonable, and tremendous limitations on housing construction, both problems are inflicted by politicians on the regular people.
Politicians decide wages private companies pay people?
In terms of minimum wage? Yes.
Billionaires and farmers selling abroad love this administration. The small enterpreneurs and wall street voted for it the most.
Back during the first "America First", there was a series of satire videos titled "America First ${COUNTRY} Second".
They're somewhat dated now, but still informative if you're curious about the rest of the world.
"Netherlands Second" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-xxis7hDOE was I believe the first second, but not only other european countries but many others globally (as well as a few regions and fictional countries) eventually produced one, easily found on YT.
Pedantry: not just the Spaniards.. they made the English pay too?
https://news.yale.edu/2015/09/22/living-artifact-dutch-golde...
America first. Because it's naturally exceptional at everything-- America is exceptionally unexceptional!!
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46826867
https://archive.is/lcy7E
That was pretty much always the point of America First. Put on your own mask before assisting others.
Unfortunately, the US has so many current problems it needs to work out that America First means America Alone until then. Unfortunately, I don't envision any of said problems being solved in any way.
I don't see any problem-solving being done, I only see the US dismantling the world it created, where - let's not kid ourselves - America always came first. The problems the US faces would be better solved with international cooperation, but the US is flushing its softpower down the toilet and destroying all goodwill amongst its allies.
This is not true. America first is not focusing on self, it is going out if its way to harm democracies out of it and create white ethnostate inside.
There is no "until then".
When "then" comes, the world will have moved on.
https://archive.md/lcy7E
FAFO
The Fight Against Federal Overreach?
* https://www.courthousenews.com/top-city-prosecutors-form-faf...
The US are having their split from the world, cleaved from within moment; all driven by a nominal desire to be great again.
Future history lessons on these moments in time will be interesting.
f*ck around and find out is my assumption of what they meant.
Mine also - worthy of note is currently those ouside the US are responding to US actions with FAFO, at the same time those within the US are responding to Federal overreach with the same attitude, hence the repurposing of the FLA (Four Letter Acronym).
What do you mean, concretely?
It seems to me like other countries are cautiously responding to threats of invasion and sudden tariffs. They did not wake up one day and randomly decided to divest from the United States.
The government overreach part I cannot comment on. From my limited point of view I see ICE and overturning Roe vs Wade, but I don't pay attention to US domestic politics.